dachelle: (still heart you)
[personal profile] dachelle
So, someone on LJ (who I won't name, as she's since deleted the post, but I think it was a good idea) was going to ask people to comment anonymously with why they love Peter/Carl/The Libertines. I was originally going to just send this in an e-mail to her, but then I thought I'd post it, because I know I've talked about the Libs a lot, obviously, but maybe never really about what draws me to them. Reading over this, it seems insufficient, but I think it goes a little way towards explaining. Anyway, if you want to read it's under the cut.

1. Peter - The first picture I saw of Peter and Carl was the second album cover, but the first picture I saw of Peter was in Entertainment Weekly magazine. It was a review of Hedi Slimane's book, and there was a picture of Peter with it, the one where he's wearing a hat and smoking a cigarette with his eyes closed and a bandage on his face. And even though I only had a vague idea of who Peter was at the time, I saved that magazine because there was something about the picture that intrigued me. I kept returning to it, again and again, and eventually I decided that Peter was someone I wanted to know more about.

It's hard to say exactly what I love about Peter because there are so many reasons I shouldn't love him. He can be so incredibly frustrating and infuriating, and there are many times when I would like to shake him and ask him what the fuck he thinks he's doing. But, at the same time, there's something in him that makes me invested enough in him to want to do that, to want better for him, if you get what I'm saying. When I think of Peter, the word that immediately comes to mind is "charming." I definitely fell for him watching and reading old interviews, and seeing him in person only solidified that. You can tell, no matter what the tabloids would have you believe, that the gears are always turning in his mind. When he's on and himself, he's bright and animated and witty, and I suppose that's why I'm so disappointed in him sometimes, because I wonder why he feels the need to take substances that mask that, that take away the expressiveness of that charming boy.

I've talked about this a bit when I've talked about my fic to others, and the fact that I do have a definite version of Peter that I tend to write, but I very much identify with the younger Peter, the Peter who lived in his head and was bookish and a bit pretentious and liable to get obsessive over any number of odd things, and I think that's why, even though our lives are very different and I don't have personal experience with a lot of the things he writes about in his songs, I can still find a connection with his lyrics. Because he's still that idealist, that dreamer, that reader, and that comes through in his songs. I love how personal his songs feel. Even though he's not a great singer, I adore his voice, and how intimate it can seem when it's just him and the guitar. I've spent a lot of quiet hours in darkened rooms just listening to those acoustic sessions. There's such beauty and heartache and truth in what he writes (and that's true of Carl as well). I don't think I'll ever get tired of listening to him. I guess that's ultimately what draws me to Peter, and what keeps me being a fan and defending him even when he does things that I don't like/don't approve of.

2. Carl - Random note: I spent several months thinking Carl was French. Like, actually French, not just in the fandom "filthy French whore" way. It was a combination of the stripey shirts and the accent mark, what can I say.

Anyway, obviously Carl is an incredibly good-looking man, and I think that is a part of what draws many fans to him initially. But as I learned more about the Libs and listened to the songs and his playing, I realized what an amazing person he is. He is so talented, and he has a definite style to his guitar playing. Lyrically, I may connect a bit more with Peter's songs overall, but Carl has written some truly wonderful stuff. "Truth Begins" can stand up with anything the Libs did, I think. And of course, on a personal level, reading about what happened with the end of the Libs and all he went through made my heart break a little, and made me develop respect for him. Of course there are two sides to every story, and I'm under no illusions that Carl is an angel, but I do think he handled himself and the situation very well.

I became a fan of Carl's forever after meeting him in Chicago in 2006. It was the first time I'd ever traveled to see a band, and he was so lovely and gracious and funny and sweet and just *genuine* in his interactions with us and all the other fans. I was really impressed by him. I think he's honestly a good person - a complicated person, but a good person. I think I've told a few people this story. It's one of the lamer moments in my life, but I was driving home once and saw a shooting star, and I was listening to the Libs, and so I made a wish that Peter would get clean, and that Carl would be happy. Because I think they both deserve that, to live happy, healthy lives - not necessarily together, you know, although that would make my slasher heart fill with glee, but whatever that means for them.

Sometimes I wish I could go back in time to when I was living in London in '98 and find a way to meet Peter and Carl then, because I think I would enjoy knowing them as people, not just as a fan. I am amazed that they're the same age as me, because sometimes they seem so much younger, and sometimes so much older, because of all that's happened in their lives. I respect them for having the courage to follow their dreams. I mean, they dropped out of school to start this band, lived in shitty flats and did shitty jobs, all in pursuit of this ideal that they really believed in, and they were only teenagers at the time. I think back to where and who I was then, and I couldn't have done what they did.

Which I suppose brings me to 3. - The Libs, and I feel a little bad because I've not mentioned John or Gary at all, who are both lovely, lovely people, and who I think brought a great deal to the band musically, particularly Gary. I don't think the Libs would sound anything like they did without his style of drumming. But a lot of the attraction of the Libs is Peter and Carl, and their story. At least, I think a lot of the passion for the band is. I mean, I love the music of The Wombats, but dear boys though they seem to be, I don't feel emotionally invested in them the way I do in the Libs. It all comes down to "blood from broken hearts," doesn't it? Like I said earlier in reference to Peter, but it applies to Carl as well, there is so much honesty in their lyrics. You can tell they didn't write to be fashionable or to sell records, but they wrote about what they loved, what mattered to them, what was going on in their lives, warts and all. They had a vision, and that comes through. I love how literate their music is. I love that I can always find something new when I listen to them, some line that suddenly strikes me, that takes on a new meaning in light of something I've read or an echo I've found in another song. I love that you do have to listen to their songs. Really, there aren't a lot of big, anthemic choruses with the Libs, but a lot of intricate verses, and I love that. I love how passionate their fans are about them, and how intelligent and literate the fans I've met are, at least on LJ (not talking about the people who go to see Peter because he's in the Sun who are there for the trainwreck aspect, but the people who are truly interested in the music).

And I love their friendship, in all its dysfunctional glory. The slash thing aside, no matter what went on or didn't between them, there is still an undeniable connection there, something special that transcends most friendships. It is a love story, really - and at times a soap opera. And I think that's why we do get so emotionally involved, because ultimately what we have are two people who just seem to belong together, and it's natural to root for them to put their differences aside and to be together again.

And finally, I love them because no matter how depressed I am, watching the first minute and a half of this will always make me smile:



ETA: If you'd like to leave your own comment about why you love/are drawn to Peter, Carl and the Libs, please do! I think anon commenting is on if you want to use that.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] spectralbovine.livejournal.com
This was lovely. It did help me understand why you love them so much.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dachelle.livejournal.com
Aw, I'm glad.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] madam-ray.livejournal.com
Aw, this makes me want to write my own one. It's funny, when I first fell for the Libs I loved Peter so much, and I definitely thought he was much prettier than Carl. Of course now I love Carl to bits and Peter winds me up something chronic. The girls think I still love Peter more deep down, but I don't know. I suppose there must be a reason why I get so horrifically pissed off at him.

Hee I love that video. Every time I hear that Coral song I end up doing the WAAAAOOOOOOOs in the background like Jawn.

Where is the Generalisimo?

In Madriiiiiiiiiiiid!

Date: 2009-04-22 07:52 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dachelle.livejournal.com
Ha, I do that too with the Coral song!

It took me a long time to admit that I found Peter attractive. Probably because when I got into the Libs it was late 2005/early 2006, and Peter was quite bad then, getting arrested all the time and shooting blood out of syringes at cameras and whatnot. Carl was less problematic! I don't really know which I love more, if I do. Carl is definitely the easier one to like, but there are more bits of Peter I identify with, I think. But that could be because Peter puts himself out there more than Carl. I don't know.

Oh, boys. I love them and their Fawlty Towers quoting.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] avriisme.livejournal.com
Subtle ;-)

I really love reading what drew or draws people to P&C and The Libs. I mean, to a certain extent, most people are going to say similar things, but there's always the little details that make it personal, and the little things that people pick out that you maybe hadn't considered much before. A lot of the time they say more about the person themselves than Peter or Carl.

Thank you for writing this.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:12 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] avriisme.livejournal.com
Psst! And if people are going to write their own, inspired by this post, please make them post on this one! I want to read! :-D

Date: 2009-04-22 07:22 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] avriisme.livejournal.com
Also, I only deleted the post because I left it for ages, and no one but you and Bianca seemed interested, so I kind of assumed everyone thought it was a lame idea (and then sulked a bit).

Date: 2009-04-22 07:26 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] adaveen.livejournal.com
So post it here! I've been too busy to read anything more than short blurbs lately.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] avriisme.livejournal.com
I might do that, yeah. - I have a collection of 18 replies, including my own, from a post I made at the start of 2007, asking basically what Courtney replied to - what draws you to P&C, personally and musically? (Posted onto a 'screened comments' post, and then reposted by me as a set of anonymous replies.) And I thought it would be nice to do it again, because a lot of people have joined my friends list since then, and I wanted to collect their answers too. - Then insert paranoia about me having made the post and thinking everyone just thought it was lame, etc. Oops?

Date: 2009-04-22 08:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] adaveen.livejournal.com
Oh, mid-week is CRAP for that sort of thing, did you just post it the other day? I've been scanning through my flist without really paying attention (because I know I should be working), and posting memes just so people won't think I'm dead - so I'm sorry I missed it.

I'm going to have to add something myself, except am right now too busy and shouldn't even be here! O.O

Date: 2009-04-28 06:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] avriisme.livejournal.com
(Sorry, completely forgot about this post until now!)

I posted the entry asking if anyone wanted to do it again, yeah. I didn't repost the answers I already had from 2007 though, in case they intimidated people somehow (I had a lot of people the first time round, going 'I would've done it, but I didn't know what to say and I bet everyone else expressed it far better than me') - but I offered to email the 2007 answers to anyone who wanted them, and I was going to repost them with the new answers that people gave me too.

Date: 2009-04-22 09:06 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] madam-ray.livejournal.com
You should re-post, I def didn't see that x

Date: 2009-04-28 06:16 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] avriisme.livejournal.com
(Sorry - been busy and I forgot about this entry until now!)

I didn't post on any communties or anything, if you're thinking you missed it. It was just on my own lj, which is friends locked. - Though you're welcome to be on it if you like!

Date: 2009-04-22 08:05 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dachelle.livejournal.com
I've added an ETA to that effect.

Date: 2009-04-22 07:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dachelle.livejournal.com
Hee. And you're welcome :-)

Date: 2009-04-22 09:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pansylove.livejournal.com
I have a lot more to say about this post later because I got love what you wrote and have a lot to comment on, but I'm short on time. :(

But this Carl - Random note: I spent several months thinking Carl was French. Like, actually French, not just in the fandom "filthy French whore" way. It was a combination of the stripey shirts and the accent mark, what can I say.

This is so embarrassing, but I thought that Carl was Spanish for about a month. It's because everyone kept calling him Carlos and this first picture I saw of him, he appeared to be very tanned. Just palmface!

Date: 2009-04-23 03:47 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dachelle.livejournal.com
Hee. Heck, I didn't realize for the longest time that his name isn't really Carlos!
(deleted comment)

Date: 2009-04-22 10:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dachelle.livejournal.com
I haven't heard that interview, I don't think. Is it available on Albion Arks?

And...yeah. The honesty gets me every time. And I think you're right that the fact that it is men doing it, men showing their vulnerability, makes it even more attractive, because it's so rare to find that, especially in rock music. I remember the first time I listened to the Libs second album all the way through "Likely Lads" made me tear up, all broken promises and lost dreams. I think the part of me that likes tragic romance gravitated towards that - it's so perfectly sad, in a way. Having said that, happy endings still don't bore me :-)

Date: 2009-04-24 01:39 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] flowergirl23.livejournal.com
Hi,

I'm new here, but just want to say that I was accidentally drawn in by the famous photograph

http://version2.andrewkendall.com/pages/photogallery/3/33.php

and had to find out more. That's when I came upon this video of "The Likely Lads"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpxXLyrCqUc

and thought these two have the perfect relationship. They seemed so happy together, in their own world.

I listened to more and more of their songs, and especially loved "Time for Heroes". It is an anthem. I got their CDs and listen to them all the time. Now I love almost every song, lyrically and musically.

I read somewhere that when you fall for the Libs, you fall hard, and that's what happened to me. I quickly ended up buying the books "The Libertines - Bound Together" and Peter Doherty's "The Books of Albion". I admire their Libertine spirit, giving away 5 CDs of music for free, having impromptu gigs at someone's flat, playing anywhere and everywhere, for even 20 people. And also the unheard-of close relationship they have with their fans.

Each has their own endearing qualities. I feel that Peter's a sweet, sensitive, poet who was perhaps unjustly kicked out of the band he loved. Though I understand the reasons, I don't understand why Carl won't come around. I also admire how Peter's so open with his feelings. And of course, there is the hotness factor. I think Carl must be the most beautiful man on Earth. Each of them separately is intriguing and alluring, but together are unbelievable.

I do hope they get together again. It does seem unfinished business. As I said, I'm new and don't know the whole history, but those are just my impressions so far.

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